Building a shop....

[Jonas Smith]

I'm going with a steel building...

I got a price on a '42-'64-'14 ( at the eaves) building, delivered to my house in Kit form for $22,345. I realize that I will have another $8k into the foundation to have it done right. Add in more for doors and windows also. That dosent even come close to the bids I have been getting on the same size or slightly smaller pole barn.
I think the Miracle Truss building will fit my use better and last longer than a pole barn. It has been said that pole barns are basicly temporary structures because the poles will eventually rot out in the concrete. Plus I really like the free span on the floor, and no voidspace in the wood trusses found in a pole barn (that uses prefab trusses).
The building looks like it can be put up by myself and 4 or 5 realtives in a weekend or two. I have a 30' a-frame (or gin-pole!) that fits on the front of our old '43 Navy GTB "burma jeep" so we wont have to rent a crane or anything to tip up the trusses.
I like the looks of a board and batt siding, and a comp roof but this building comes with steel sides, steel roof and a 30year maintenence free warranty.
The other deciding factor was when I got the brochure from miracle truss, theres a picture of a WDX type Power Wagon with a snow blower installed on front and 3' of snow on the roof of the building! It's fate I tell ya!

[MoparNorm]

That's the way to go (see all my other long and boring posts!) Pre-engineered and ready to install. Get the frame up, PLUMB all walls first, then install your longest wall sheeting for plumb and bracing purposes and you're ready to go. Install all walls first then the roof (backwards from conventional building) It should go pretty quick. The best tool to have is a fork lift, a couple of cordless nut/screw drivers will make it go faster. I errected a 60 x 120 Building in two weeks with one helper, it won't take long! You should recieve a foundation plan and an anchor bolt placement sheet from the Building Manufactuer, stick to it and it will be simple.
MN

[MoparNorm]

Jonas,...

I received your e-mail, thanks!

[49 T&C]

A couple of thoughts for your garage - Before you pour the slab, run LOTS of PVC chases under the concrete from one end to the other, Stub them up and cap'em off. When you want to run electrical, water or air from one end to the other, you will really appreciate not having to climb up and run conduit overhead.

Check with your local county school board. Ours has a disposal auction every 6 months or so for big stuff, but they sell "little" things constantly. Call around your area - I picked up 20 -8' flourscent fixtures with bulbs for $1.oo each. I also got a nice untra-sonic cleaner (used in a science lab) for $5.00. Its big enough for a carb or handgun. I also got a nice 'welding table from a metal shoip for $5.00. Gym lockers became a nice POL storage and were $10 ea.


Pickup a used dishwasher, use it for a parts washer. They are cheap and it will keep you in good standing with your wife if you don't use hers.

Keep a GOOD fire extinguisher accessable. You need as good stereo, hang the speakers from the ceiling to not use floorspace.

My shed is 300 ft away from the house. I installed inexpensive IR motion detectors 4' above the floor. The dog won't set them off, but an unwelcomed visitor will. I am alerted in the house if the IR's go off. It's amazing how the sound of cycling a 12ga. gets people's attention...

Mine is 40 X 54 X 14 high. Its not big enough!!! Got 4 vehicles in it now, tool crib and storage and work area. 480 sq ft additional storage above the tool crib & its still not big enough!!

Go as big as you can afford.

49 T&C

[Gordon Maney]

Given that I have a background in manufacturing industry, I am no stranger to a tool crib. However, I have to realize I never considered one for a home shop.

I think I like the idea. How big is your tool crib? Is it a chain link fence cage? How did you set it up inside?

[49 T&C]

The tool crib is 12' x 24' with a 4' opening so I can get engine hoist/sandblaster/engine test stand in & out with having to take them apart. Shelves for power tools (circular saws/sawsall/angle grinders, etc. Jackstands, ladders, etc. The idea is to have one place for tools you don't use often but you don't have to hunt the things down all over the shed.

It has an 8' ceiling and almost 300 sq ft of household storage above it.

Another suggestion is to place your air compressor AS FAR AWAY FROM THE SHED AS POSSIBLE!!! At least mount it outside (but covered).

49 T&C

[powerwagontim]

Hi All,

I thought I might weigh in with my shop experiences. I, like Norm, am a Builder. It doesn't matter what size you build, it wont be large enough. You will fill the available space. (nature abhors a vacuum!)

My shop, in Vermont is 44 x 56, with a full "attic" 32x44 is dedicated to my cabinet shop, the upstairs in that section is lumber storage and a paint room. Of the balance, 24 x 28 is the garage, 2 bays, one taken up with a long term project, a 1960 Triumph TR-3A.

I try to keep the second bay clear for shorter term projects (backhoe, Power Wagon, Triumph Spitfire, wife's van, company trucks, kids bikes... always something. The rest of the square is an unheated shed space with sliding doors.

There is an attached pole barn wing, 24 x 45 for storage of equipment in this frozen northern wasteland I call home. The main section of the shop is on a thickened edge slab, on a bed of stone. We framed the walls conventionally with 2x6s on 24" centers. We used steel strapping as diagonal braces, then put rough sawn 1x6s horizontally on 24" centers for purlins. a layer of house wrap then green steel siding (roofing) SCREWED on.

I priced using T-111 plywood for siding, the steel cost less, comes painted and will last longer than the T-111 and look nicer too. A no brainer.

The ceiling is wood I-joists. I wanted a clear span in the wood shop. The garage has a big steel I beam running front to back, the floor joists rest on top of that. The roof is framed conventionally with 2x12 rafters, 1x6 purlins and galvanized roofing. I have had no leaks.

As Norm pointed out, if you apply materials properly, they will perform properly. (properly isn't always the quickest, and there is nothing wrong with reading the manufacturers information on how they want their product installed!) I have been very pleased with the shop, it is about 8 years old now.

Thanks, Tim

[MoparNorm]

Hi Tim,
Sounds pretty stout!
Two things that you can never have enough of....storage space and shop area! I downsized a 3,000 sq. ft. shop into 1,000. What a pain! I don't think that I could live with less than 3,500 sq. ft. and that is for starters!
Shop Shoehorn
MN

[powerwagontim]

Hi Norm,
Too true. To help on the storage issue, I connected my pole barn to the shop, giving an additional 20 feet, and weeded out alot of what I had felt a need to store. There is still alot which my wife would not see fit to store, but thats a different story. Now, how to add to the garage...
Tim

[jdog]

gutters on pole buildings

Any building without ventilation should not have gutters.
Gutters are not a solution for ice damming, rather it will compound the problem. This is especially true if the building is heated. Two things are needed to prevent ice damming, and there must be an appropriate amount of each. They are insulation and ventilation. This keeps the underside of the roof cool preventing snow melting and freezing at the eave where the heat builds up less. The more heat you have in the building, the more insulation and ventilation required to keep the roof cool. Also, overhangs at the eave create a cool space for the melting snow to freeze. Avoid overhangs at the eaves and spend your money on insulation and venting. In a nut shell , the closer you keep the attic temp( and ultimately the underside of the roof) to the outside ambient temp the less chance you have of ice damming. P.S. Snow has to melt, but it doesnt have to freeze until it hits the ground. Suprised this wasnt learned before the million square foot mark!

[MoparNorm]

To which post was your reply addressed?
MN

[Dodgeum]

Never to big. This one is 40 x 80 with drive through doors, front and back. Half for vehicle and half for storage. I started out with a 8 x 12 shed then a 30 x 50 pole barn and still need more room.

[Steve Pellock]

Hi Jonas. I have a 40' x 80' x 20' metal building that we added another 50' x 80' to as a wood shop. The original is used for welding, equipment storage/repairs. In the middle of the 40' x 80' is my C1 that has been torn apart for 2 years. In the winter I park our fleet of 4 trucks in there too. Not much extra space. Marty has at least 2 laps on me on the rebuilding. It seems to take up a lot of floor space. I agree with your dad if you are going to have 4 vehicles. I would go as big as you can afford. The snow load in our part of Wisconsin is 40# live load. Commercial buildings have 6' o/c post spacing. Some ag applications have 8' or 10'. With your snow load I would place them closer. Compare metal to post frame. If you go post frame use laminated columns. Everyone makes a big deal about Morton but I would rate their package average in quality at best. I can e-mail a picture of the shop interior with a rolling frame if you would like, to see how much extra space their is.

[Jonas Smith]

I went with the miracle truss steel building

I'm pretty happy with the product. I have a so/so feeling about the company itself. A neighbor went with a building made by websteel out of Oregon and saved $4000 over me for the same basic size building. That said, he was not happy when his building arrived as the structural members are made out of formed sheetmetal in some places giving it a "tinny" feel. The miracle truss is built out of good thick steel channel, plate and rod.
I have the sides and windows on finally, now just need to save up some $ for a roll up door, electrical, and air throughout.