Framing Nailers-Cordless vs Pneumatic

[bosco]

I've got a need for a framing gun and am indecisive about which way to go ... cordless or air. In the past I have used a friends cordless paslode nailer and really like it. I realize they are a bit expensive, but not sure if it's worth the extra bucks over the cost of an air driven nailer. I have a compressor, so that cost would not be an issue.

What would you recommend if you were purchasing your first framing gun..? It would be used quite often and I would like a something very dependable.

Gordon, I did read the thread you had started some time back about air nailers ... which model did you decide on?

Thanks.....

[Gordon Maney]

Re: Framing Nailers-Cordless vs Pneumatic

Originally posted by bosco
I've got a need for a framing gun and am indecisive about which way to go ... cordless or air. In the past I have used a friends cordless paslode nailer and really like it. I realize they are a bit expensive, but not sure if it's worth the extra bucks over the cost of an air driven nailer. I have a compressor, so that cost would not be an issue.

What would you recommend if you were purchasing your first framing gun..? It would be used quite often and I would like a something very dependable.

Gordon, I did read the thread you had started some time back about air nailers ... which model did you decide on?

Thanks.....

I have not purchased one yet. If I do, I may base my choice on the fact that I would only use it here, and might want to build a cabin out in a reforestation project where there may not be electricity. In that case, the impulse gun would be neat. I will be interested to see what comments you get.

[MoparNorm]

I use

A Senco 602 series Framing Gun. Fairly light weight, durable and I have both electric and gas powered compressors so location and utilities are not a factor.
For everyday use, I'd be leary of the cordless and Paslode models. I'm talking shooting 2,500 to 5,000 nails per day so limited use may make a difference for you, but you do NOT see those type of guns on the job site, only at small production or homeowner projects. The Paslode cartridges are too expensive to use the gun for everyday use and the drability is a question. The cordless guns are too new and light duty to have a proven track record, their target market is the homeowner who shoots three dozen nails on a weekend project and calls it a day.
MN
Added a link to the Senco web page; Senco

[Bill in MI]

I have a Porter-Cable FR350A Nail gun and really like it. Altough it is not my main occupation I have been a licensed builder for 20 yrs. The nail gun really sped up my work output.

[MoparNorm]

The Porter-Cable FR350A is a good gun, It's a little over a pound heavier than the Senco and about two pounds heavier than a Hitachi. That's not a big deal for casual use, but for all day, non-stop shooting it adds up. Probably not an issue for the use intended here. Another consideration is the range of nails that one gun can shoot. Most common is to be able to shoot a 6d to 16d nail. otherwise you will need a gun for every penny nail shot, not very cost effective.
One thing that IS important, regardless of the gun chosen is the NAILS. Some guns, such as Hilti use gun manufacturer specific nails, that means you have to buy their nails which are usually very expensive. The nail you must buy is controlled by the degree angle of the feed magazine. Look in the gun specs and see what the feed angle is, then go nail shopping FIRST to price the nails. You'll see that wholesale bulk gun nails sold in 35 or 50 lb boxes are much cheaper than the gun manufactuers tiny boxes of nails.
Some manufacturers have patents on their nails and they cannot be produced by others (Hilti 19 degrees). Porter Cable (22 degrees), Senco (21-23 degrees), Hitachi (22-23 degrees) and a few other guns can shoot a generic nail, thereby saving way more money than the gun price over the life of the gun. BE SURE that your gun can shoot a FULL HEADED nail, "C" or "D" headed nails are not legal in some states and have poor holding value.
MN

[bosco]

Good point, on the nails MoparNorm. There are a few places I will check on this weekend to find out what nails are available and the cost of them.

The weight of the gun is also important to me, of course I wont be using it to make a living. Only using it for rebuilding my barn and putting up a new 3 rail fence. The fence project is what made me think of the cordless gun. I sure would hate to load my compresser and generator on the trailer, but it can be done.

[powerwagontim]

Hi Bosco,
I would stay away from the Paslode impulse like the plague. I have one and its been trouble from the start. It has been into the repair shop several times and they cant find anything or they find something that will fix it and it still wont work reliably. It will work awhile, then not, then yes. Why I havent thrown it off a high roof baffles me.
I had an old Paslode framer that I bought 19 years ago. That gun was a workhorse. I broke the blade off on it and am told Paslode no longer makes parts for it. It was such a good tool that I bought another Paslose air framer. When I get done throwing the Impulse off the roof I may climb down the ladder and get that gun and see if it can fly. I used to really sing Paslode's praises but not anymore. I now have 2 Senco framers. One, almost brand new has the annoying habit of double firing. All guns will do this but not if you are consious of it. This gun will do it no matter what. I WANT MY OLD PASLODE BACK, WAAAAAAA.
Tim

[MoparNorm]

Hi Tim,

I put a small in-line regulator at the end of my gun (it actually helps with the balance) I found out that two things cause the double firing, mine did it too a few times, too much air pressure causing the gun to "bounce" and resulting in your finger coming off the trigger slightly. The other is the collating plastic getting stuck in the tip. Different brand nails have different types of plastic.
Were you impact nailing or pulling the trigger one nail at a time? Mine works better to just lock the trigger down and use the impact feature, the regulator at the handel saves walking all the way back to the compressor or climbing down the ladder since the compressor always ends up 300 feet from where you are when you need to adjust the pressure.....= )
MN

[powerwagontim]

Hi Norm,
This new Senco is the first full round head gun I have owned. The plastic collating material is a real menace. The little bits of plastic fly off and sting when they ding off your face. I always wear safty glasses but its not too far fetched to imagine a piece slipping in behind them. I suspect its the collating material causing the double whammy. We have both framers set up to bump fire instead of sequential trip. I may try the regulator. Seems like an easy test.
Thanks,
Tim

[MoparNorm]

Yeah they smart don't they!

I've had more junk pulled out of my eyes than I care to remember. Now that I wear contacts it's easy to find really nice eye protection that wraps around and still breathes, AND WORKS! No more vented (which never worked!) rubber divers masks! ha!ha!
Even if the regulator fails to completely stop the occasional double fire, it is really a time saver if you are far from the compressor and shooting two different types of nails in the same area. CA siesmic codes are good but engineers are office anal with little or no field experience, it is not uncommon to have two nailing schedules on the same floor or wall which requires changing from 8d .148 nails to 10d .131 nails or even 16d nails. You simply set the compressor at the highest required psi and regulate down at the gun, it works great! I found a regulator that is very small and precise, I'll try to find a photo for you.
MN

[bosco]

Tim ... thanks for the info on the Paslode impluse gun. I will definetly stay away from it.

Tomorrow I'll be heading to Home Depot to check out the Senco 602 and the Porter Cable FR350A. But just for the heck of it I just checked out their website tonight and this is what I found:

Porter Cable FR350A for 229 bucks.

Senco 602 was not listed.

Senco 702XP with free palm nailer for 299.

Per the Senco website, the 602 comes with a 1 year warranty while the 702XP comes with a 2 year warranty. The specs state that the 702XP is a tad smaller, but also a tad heavier (by only .3 pounds). Does anyone have the 702XP, if so ... comments please.

Norm ... does the addition of that inline regulator add to the overall length of the gun..? For instance, will I be able to get the gun between a set of rafters (24" oc)...?

As for safety glasses, I use the ones I get at work. They are ANSI Z-87 certified ... a must in the plants. They work great for any carpentry work. Even got a set with a reading lense built in (very nice for old eyes). They cover the eyes very well and I have not had a problem with anything entering my eyes while wearing them.

[MoparNorm]

The regulator....

....doesn't interfer, you can get the gun between 16" oc rafters or studs(I'm trying to envision a scenario where the gun could not be turned to fit).
I can't remember the brand name of the filter, but it's very small and has a flat or low profile gauge face. I tried to find an on-line photo but couldn't.
The 702 XP is the top of the line, for now, production nailer, there must be some internal changes in it and a palm nail actually comes in pretty handy for nailing hangers and brackets and getting into those tight places where a gun or hammer will not fit.
MN

[bosco]

Good to hear that the gun will have no interference issues with with 16"oc spacing.

If I buy the Senco 602 or 702 tomorrow, what type of nails would be recommended for 1) basic framing of stud walls, rafters and joist. 2) exterior sheating, ie T111...? I've used the ring shank many times before, but if you need to remove those nails ... well you know it ain't easy. I just want to be sure I use the correct nail for the job.

Thanks

[powerwagontim]

Hi Bosco,
For framing stud walls use 16 penny nails (3 1/4") For the T-111, make sure the nails are galvanized, 8 penny (2 1/4") and I would go with the ringshanks. If you are worried about removing them, use duplex form nails! (they have 2 heads for easy removal). A palm nailer is a great tool. I scoffed at them for years and finally bought one. I was an instant convert. They are really handy. The first tme you use one your co workers will turn in awe and ask what the heck you had for dinner. BRRRRRAAAAAAAPPPPP!
Tim

[Sickcall]

Those 16d nails should be coated sinkers, whatever Senco nails are using. Make sure you use your flush nailer attachment for the siding, and galvanized 8d.