Who's 4BT swap uses a Ford overdrive tranny?

[slozukimc]

I saw a post that talked about a FordCummins adapter for running a Ford 5 speed tranny in an M37. I have a 92 Ford F350 4x4 with a 460 and 5 speed tranny. Is this the right one to use with the 4BT in my M37? What are the issues with this swap?

Thanks, Mike

[CGarbee]

I am running a 94 ZF S5-42 five speed out of a Ford F250HD (diesel, but is the same as found behind the big block gasser, smallblock version had different input shaft/output yoke, and gear ratios).

Using a flywheel adadpter from Roger at www.fordcummins.com

Using a Dodge flywheel from a 92 RAM 2500 w/Cummins. Dodge starter from the 92 Cummins RAM. Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '92 (Getrag five speed that was used in the Dodge has the same input shaft that ZF used on the S5-42).

Ford slave cylinder for the clutch (94 F250HD, upgrade part, individual instead of the slave/line/master combo), Tilton remote reservoir master cylinder.

Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '94


You have to trim a little excess off the Cummins block flange (right above the oil pan) at the starter location on the passenger side and grind a little off the inside of the transmisison where the starter nose is located, but neither bit of metal is very structural... Roger has some detailed photos and measurements of both "tweak" areas on his website.

Meanwhile, I really like the feel of the transmission behind the Cummins 4BT in my '53 M37. the instalation is covered in various sections of my website.

Ask away if I missed anything.

[slozukimc]

I can't find it........

I am running a 94 ZF S5-42 five speed out of a Ford F250HD (diesel, but is the same as found behind the big block gasser, smallblock version had different input shaft/output yoke, and gear ratios).

Using a flywheel adadpter from Roger at www.fordcummins.com

Using a Dodge flywheel from a 92 RAM 2500 w/Cummins. Dodge starter from the 92 Cummins RAM. Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '92 (Getrag five speed that was used in the Dodge has the same input shaft that ZF used on the S5-42).

Ford slave cylinder for the clutch (94 F250HD, upgrade part, individual instead of the slave/line/master combo), Tilton remote reservoir master cylinder.

Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '94


You have to trim a little excess off the Cummins block flange (right above the oil pan) at the starter location on the passenger side and grind a little off the inside of the transmisison where the starter nose is located, but neither bit of metal is very structural... Roger has some detailed photos and measurements of both "tweak" areas on his website.

Meanwhile, I really like the feel of the transmission behind the Cummins 4BT in my '53 M37. the instalation is covered in various sections of my website.

Ask away if I missed anything.

Been looking through your site for 2 days now trying to find that info.......I find the SM420 with the Ranger overdrive but nothing about the Ford tranny. Must not be looking in the right place I guess....;>)

Why did you go away from the Ranger and 420? I like that idea but was very concerned about the price of the overdrive unit itself. How much did the Ranger cost? I am curious how well the SM420 holds up to the torque of the Cummins over a period of time.

Another thought.....You retained the SM420 so you could keep the stock winch setup......That is one of the reasons I was impressed with that setup as I have the winch a parts to install it just haven't done it yet as the winch needs some work...That's another post for another time. Do you still have the winch setup with the Ford 5 speed?

Other than being a cleaner installation is there another reason why you went with the internal slave? I see now that is talking about the Ranger setup......Is it still the same setup with the Ford tranny? I like the idea of an external for service reasons in the field.....I would hate to have to pull the whole tranny to fix a slave cylinder by myself in the middle of nowhere. (I have this wild idea that someday I want to drive the M37 all the way around the furthest edges of North America.....)

I will have to look at the tranny I found to see how it is set up now. I would really prefer a manual linkage type clutch but from what you have already described with making it fit in there with all of the other stuff I think I might better shy away from that idea. The new hydraulic setups are much more dependable now I guess......I got a bad taste for changing internal slaves in Ford Rangers as they had a habit of going bad with not many miles on them for a time.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP!!!! I couldn't even consider a swap like this without all of the priceless information stored in all of your heads..........I've always said "If you don't have a clue; ask someone who does." Since I started asking questions here I have more clues than I know what to do with!!! LOL

THANKS AGAIN, Mike

[CGarbee]

Been looking through your site for 2 days now trying to find that info.......I find the SM420 with the Ranger overdrive but nothing about the Ford tranny. Must not be looking in the right place I guess....;>)

It's in bits and pieces around the site... Most of the info is actually on the photos pages concering transmission and clutch... Got a page to load tonight concerning the intermediate driveshaft... Need to clean up the links on the homepage so that they point to the newer transmission info.

Why did you go away from the Ranger and 420? I like that idea but was very concerned about the price of the overdrive unit itself. How much did the Ranger cost? I am curious how well the SM420 holds up to the torque of the Cummins over a period of time.

Both the Ranger and the NP420 (actually, the earlier model 88950) held up very well to the Cummins (especially considering how I like to run around with a loaded truck and trailer on the hills...)... Ranger was a custom unit that took me six months of chatting with the guys at Advance to get them to build and I had to buy more than one... My cost was $1700 each at the time. I have the one that was in my truck available for sale for less considering that it is now used... Email me directly if you want to talk about it. Got rid of it entirely to make it easier for friends to drive the truck. I got really tired of expaining to folks how to drive a truck with twin sticks...

Another thought.....You retained the SM420 so you could keep the stock winch setup......That is one of the reasons I was impressed with that setup as I have the winch a parts to install it just haven't done it yet as the winch needs some work...That's another post for another time. Do you still have the winch setup with the Ford 5 speed?

Still got the stock winch. Just run a Chelsea 352 series PTO on the ZF transmission. Went with a cable actuated model instead of a lever mounted one in order to keep the floor clear of stuff (got tired of kicking the lever on the stock PTO...). Got to do a webpage for that once I get some time...

Other than being a cleaner installation is there another reason why you went with the internal slave? I see now that is talking about the Ranger setup......Is it still the same setup with the Ford tranny? I like the idea of an external for service reasons in the field.....I would hate to have to pull the whole tranny to fix a slave cylinder by myself in the middle of nowhere. (I have this wild idea that someday I want to drive the M37 all the way around the furthest edges of North America.....)

ZF S5-42 uses an external slave, the newere S5-47 uses an internal one. I like having it out where I can see it... Had to go with a larger bore Tilton MC than what I had to get everthing to match, but it bolted right up on the bracket that I had made... Call me when you make your trip I'll either join you or leave the light on for when you pass by...:)

I will have to look at the tranny I found to see how it is set up now. I would really prefer a manual linkage type clutch but from what you have already described with making it fit in there with all of the other stuff I think I might better shy away from that idea. The new hydraulic setups are much more dependable now I guess......I got a bad taste for changing internal slaves in Ford Rangers as they had a habit of going bad with not many miles on them for a time.

I prefer the manual setup as well, but the hydrualic one is working well 25000 miles after being installed...

THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP!!!! I couldn't even consider a swap like this without all of the priceless information stored in all of your heads..........I've always said "If you don't have a clue; ask someone who does." Since I started asking questions here I have more clues than I know what to do with!!! LOL

My pleasure... I'm just glad that more folks are making the attempt these days... When I did mine, I had to do all my info hunting by phone...

THANKS AGAIN, Mike

I inserted my answeres after each of the questions in the reply, but didn't feel like reworking the quote blocks, so you have to hunt around in the above text block to find my answers... sorry...

My pleasure... I'm just glad that more folks are making the attempt these days... When I did mine, I had to do all my info hunting by phone...

[didget69]

I am running a 94 ZF S5-42 five speed out of a Ford F250HD (diesel, but is the same as found behind the big block gasser, smallblock version had different input shaft/output yoke, and gear ratios).

Using a flywheel adadpter from Roger at www.fordcummins.com

Using a Dodge flywheel from a 92 RAM 2500 w/Cummins. Dodge starter from the 92 Cummins RAM. Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '92 (Getrag five speed that was used in the Dodge has the same input shaft that ZF used on the S5-42).

Ford slave cylinder for the clutch (94 F250HD, upgrade part, individual instead of the slave/line/master combo), Tilton remote reservoir master cylinder.

Clutch was ordered on-line from Dial-A-Clutch and is the OEM grade one used on the '94


You have to trim a little excess off the Cummins block flange (right above the oil pan) at the starter location on the passenger side and grind a little off the inside of the transmisison where the starter nose is located, but neither bit of metal is very structural... Roger has some detailed photos and measurements of both "tweak" areas on his website.

Meanwhile, I really like the feel of the transmission behind the Cummins 4BT in my '53 M37. the instalation is covered in various sections of my website.

Ask away if I missed anything.

Cabell -

Here is another online clutch source - I ordered clutches from them for 4 vehicles; seem to be good prices & have had fast deliveries -

http://www.clutchcityonline.com/ford_pickup_73.htm

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