The mileage project

[mcinfantry]

That's pretty cool!
A stock 4.2 in line six Jeep puts out 240 lbs of torque. Mine puts out 350 lbs, I'd like more.
Funny that you posted ... "ive never heard of anyone, anywhere looking for off-road performance increases. its always been on-road specific power increases."
You need to come on out to SoCal and see what we do out here, it's all about off-road performance, low rpm grunt, even with the CJ's. I suppose it's same with the boys from Texas, Colorado and New Mexico. In Moab, they're putting up some pretty big numbers, but they are doing it with gassers. In our western rocks you need to putt at low rpm and still move over obstacles. 1 mph is sometimes too fast, but we still need torque.
Not much mud out here and too much work to clean up properly, but it is fun.....
Have pictures of the install in the 715?

i do. i also have plenty from the wc53( a better install, imo)

i said no one with a 4bt has ever talked of offroad power increases.

and neither the jeep 4.2 or any chevrolet 350 puts out 200 ft lbs of tq at 1000 rpm. none. a 4bt produce useable tq off-idle. the above video was initially attempted in 3rd, low range. when the engine stalled, i tried in second and made history. please not, i was NOT feathering the clutch. when the strap tightened i was 100% off the clutch

show me the dyno chart from one.

[MoparNorm]

That's pretty cool!
A stock 4.2 in line six Jeep puts out 240 lbs of torque @ 3,000 rpm, 205 off idle. Mine puts out 350 lbs @ 2500 rpm, 250 off idle, that's so so for a Jeep CJ, I'd like more for a 1 ton.
Funny that you posted ... "ive never heard of anyone, anywhere looking for off-road performance increases. its always been on-road specific power increases."
You need to come on out to SoCal and see what we do out here, it's all about off-road performance, on road performance from non-diesels is pretty much illegal. We're looking for low rpm grunt, even with the CJ's. I suppose it's same with the boys from Texas, Colorado and New Mexico. In Moab, they're putting up some pretty big numbers, but they are doing it with gassers. In our western rocks you need to putt at low rpm and still move over obstacles. 1 mph is sometimes too fast, but we still need torque.
Not much mud out here and too much work to clean up properly, but it is fun.....
Have pictures of the install in the 715?

Ha!Ha! That's your suspicious Cop nature...= )
I don't have a chart or print out of my 4.2, but here is a 4.0 chart (which has less torque than the 4.2)



Post some pictures or email then to me, I'd like to see the fit and clearance, I have a Grand Wagoner that I was looking for a diesel to install, same firewall sheet metal and engine bay dimensions as the M715.

[mcinfantry]

Ha!Ha! That's your suspicious Cop nature...= )
I don't have a chart or print out of my 4.2, but here is a 4.0 chart (which has less torque than the 4.2)



Post some pictures or email then to me, I'd like to see the fit and clearance, I have a Grand Wagoner that I was looking for a diesel to install, same firewall sheet metal and engine bay dimensions as the M715.

ok, ill try and dig some up. its a REAL easy fit in a waggy.

i see your dyno chart , but it isnt useable.

you can get in a 4bt truck, dump the clutch and it WONT stall. i may be headed out your way later this summer, or if you get anywhere near me, you are welcome to drive it.

[MoparNorm]

ok, ill try and dig some up. its a REAL easy fit in a waggy.

i see your dyno chart , but it isnt useable.

you can get in a 4bt truck, dump the clutch and it WONT stall. i may be headed out your way later this summer, or if you get anywhere near me, you are welcome to drive it.

The dyno shows 200 ft lbs at 1,000, for the stock 4.0. My 4.2 torquer can idle up a 15% slope with me walking beside it, but it's not enough motor for a 1 ton.
I'd love to see and drive your rig, it looks sweet! Maybe we could meet at Jim's and you can see his 4bt Townie at the same time.
Thanks!

[JimmieD]

I have to agree with McInfantry on this. I have zero diesel experience before my conversion so I was utterly amazed at the result. Even with truck very heavily loaded, pulling another truck very heavily loaded, just ease out the clutch, no throttle, in 2nd gear to start!

Towed my Chevy Luv down here with the Townie. Townie was full to the roof with all I could cram in, including the floor covered with scrap steel, boxes of tools, heavy truck parts etc. and LUV was full of scrap metal, parts and misc. Can't know for sure, but Townie at least 2,000 in the back, Luv at least 1,250. Townie weighs 2.6 ton empty. I could feel the strain but made every hill with ease, no problems at all. Only thing that limited speeds was LUV wanting to hula on the towbar. Averaged over 19.5 mpg for 600 miles! Have never needed 1st gear [4.1 final with 29" tires] except coming up the steep and rutted driveway with this load.

If EVERYTHING went right a SKILLED fabricator with good tools could do the swap for $4,000. 'Million Mile Motor' and a premium drivetrain like NV4500 and Dana 60 axles, heavy-duty components and you're good for the duration. At 30+ mpg and extremely low maintenance it doesn't get any better, and no electronics but 1 wire for fuel solenoid.

[mcinfantry]

i think it could be done for 4000. your right, its has to line up, but possible

[Gordon Maney]

I have to agree with McInfantry on this. I have zero diesel experience before my conversion so I was utterly amazed at the result. Even with truck very heavily loaded, pulling another truck very heavily loaded, just ease out the clutch, no throttle, in 2nd gear to start!

Towed my Chevy Luv down here with the Townie. Townie was full to the roof with all I could cram in, including the floor covered with scrap steel, boxes of tools, heavy truck parts etc. and LUV was full of scrap metal, parts and misc. Can't know for sure, but Townie at least 2,000 in the back, Luv at least 1,250. Townie weighs 2.6 ton empty. I could feel the strain but made every hill with ease, no problems at all. Only thing that limited speeds was LUV wanting to hula on the towbar. Averaged over 19.5 mpg for 600 miles! Have never needed 1st gear [4.1 final with 29" tires] except coming up the steep and rutted driveway with this load.

If EVERYTHING went right a SKILLED fabricator with good tools could do the swap for $4,000. 'Million Mile Motor' and a premium drivetrain like NV4500 and Dana 60 axles, heavy-duty components and you're good for the duration. At 30+ mpg and extremely low maintenance it doesn't get any better, and no electronics but 1 wire for fuel solenoid.

I may have missed something in this thread, but where did you get the 30+ miles per gallon figure?

....and in this scenario, how are we sourcing the engine; the Frito truck approach?

[mcinfantry]

avg mpg, here in louisiana was 24 to 26mpg. thats city and hwy and running almost 75.

i ONCE drove from mobile al to near baton rouge slightly higher than 30mpg.

that was a used, not tuned up, 140,000+ mile frito engine.

that was in a almost 7000lb curb weight m715 with 4.56 gears, 38.6" tires and nv4500

[Gordon Maney]

avg mpg, here in louisiana was 24 to 26mpg. thats city and hwy and running almost 75.

i ONCE drove from mobile al to near baton rouge slightly higher than 30mpg.

that was a used, not tuned up, 140,000+ mile frito engine.

that was in a almost 7000lb curb weight m715 with 4.56 gears, 38.6" tires and nv4500

Wow — neat!

Thank you...

[mcinfantry]

Wow — neat!

Thank you...

i forgot to add that was 55mph on the 30mpg

[Gordon Maney]

mcinfantry, is there a thread somewhere here where you describe how you configured the M715? ....or would you comment on that in this thread, as an alternative?

Which particular 4BT did you use, what transmission, what tire size? Does the M715 have a 4.88 axle ratio, or something else?

Also, are the Frito truck sources drying up by now?

[JimmieD]

4BT Rock & Roll formula

4BT performance is not lacking stock and hop-up is E-Z and cheap! Diesels want fuel and air & exhaust. Stock we see 105-120hp & 350+ ft lbs torque. EGT's as Exhaust Gas Temperatures are quick death to diesels above about 1,300* sustained. Stock 4Bt runs 750*-800* towing. More fuel = higher EGT unless more air comes in.

Bosch VE pump can be easily tweaked for more fuel: 3,200 rpm governor spring raises the power range, cost $20 and some time. Simple fuel adjustments, only adjustments, raise hp to 200, torque to 400. Add an HTT Stage II or III compressor housing and wheel to turbo for about $200-$300, more air! Add an aftercooler [about $250-$300] unless it's already aftercooled [4BTA] allows denser mixture and lowers EGT's. Add complete 4" exhaust from turbo outlet, including muffler, about $200 home built. Add water/methanol injection kit, runs from $200 for manual, $750 for full-auto, cools clyinder temps, lowers EGT's and increases power and can eliminate the need for aftercooler. Injected methanol is cehaper than diesel, and the water is free. May be used as needed, not fulltime unless desired. You can now add larger injectors because the hardware is in place to control otherwise catastrophic EGT's. Injectors run from $250 to $600.

Results: about 400 to 450 hp, 600-800 ft lbs torque, 400+ torque off idle! $675-$1,000 w/o injectors, $1,000-$1,400 with injectors. 3 times the power, 2 times the torque of a stock 1st Gen 6BT, still 'good' mileage in the 20's. Beat that?

One MUST install a Pyrometer [exhaust gas temperature sensor & gauge] about $100-$150, to monitor EGT's with high performance tweaks.

[mcinfantry]

the frito sources are not drying up, they are decreasing, but now that they are on dovebid, you are bidding nationwide. its kind of like the gov liq fiasco. the speculators/tire kickers are driving prices up, but in the same token some buy the stuff only to realize it is well past their pay grades and have to literally unload the stuff.......


there is NOT an infinite supply of the 4bt, but in the same token most of us only really need one.

next post is m715/4bt

[JimmieD]

Hey, mcinfantry, I wrote that from memory, or what's left of it :~ ). Do those numbers above sound right to you from our conversations 'elsewhere'?

[mcinfantry]

Hey, mcinfantry, I wrote that from memory, or what's left of it :~ ). Do those numbers above sound right to you from our conversations 'elsewhere'?

looks like 160 is more reasonable w/o any money. the guy running 200 has swapped turbo and a few things... i digress.