5.9 cummins auto swap to roadranger

[rmcoates]

Hi guys, new member .... old truck. I have a 96 Dodge 4x4 3500 5.9 cummins auto tranny. I hate automatics... it's got to go. All my life I wanted a pickup with a diesel engine and roadranger tranny. Well, I have the engine and components. I want to pull it out and part out the rest of the truck, mate the engine with the rt6609 9 speed roadranger. I found a bellhousing, clutch assy and flywheel on Ebay from a 5.9 that had a fs4005a tranny. Does anyone know if the roadranger will match up? Has anyone put a roadranger behind a 5.9? Can't seem to get much help online... but I have faith in this great forum I've just joined. Nice work guys... kewep it up.

[pieter]

Welcome!

sounds like an interesting project. I personally have not heard of that combination, but anything is possible..

Others will be along shortly to chime in....

Pieter

[MoparNorm]

Welcome!
JimmieD has converted his Town Wagon to a Cummins, he may be up on the trans bolt pattern. From what I've heard, several bell housings will adapt to the Cummins so it may well be possible to find one that will bolt to both your trans and the Cummins.
Curious, what makes the Road Ranger so special and what are you trying to achieve with it, vs. other transmission options?

[JimmieD]

Hi guys, new member .... old truck. I have a 96 Dodge 4x4 3500 5.9 cummins auto tranny. I hate automatics... it's got to go. All my life I wanted a pickup with a diesel engine and roadranger tranny. Well, I have the engine and components. I want to pull it out and part out the rest of the truck, mate the engine with the rt6609 9 speed roadranger. I found a bellhousing, clutch assy and flywheel on Ebay from a 5.9 that had a fs4005a tranny. Does anyone know if the roadranger will match up? Has anyone put a roadranger behind a 5.9? Can't seem to get much help online... but I have faith in this great forum I've just joined. Nice work guys... kewep it up.

Well sir, welcome, and an ambitious project indeed. That's one solid piece of tranny if synchros aren't a big deal to you, but hey, who needs 'em!? Probably looking at an SAE 1,2 or 3 pattern, not sure, but some kind of SAE I suppose. Any decent truck repair shop can tell you.

Unlikely there's an off the shelf adapter available but at least one place, Wilcap, can machine one up for you. Possibility you can do that yourself, too. Many times an adapter will have enough meat in the right areas to whip our the old drill and bore some new mounting holes, either for tranny or adapter plate.

Some Cummins already have SAE adapter plates. The little tow motor versions of 4BT's in lift trucks or industrial equipment often have same. That could be an easy way to get started where you're going. I'm speaking of going with Roadranger compatable parts that also use SAE pattern on engine side, then just slap the Cummins SAE adapter plate on and call it good.

May have to spacer flywheel, change pilot, rig hydro clutch. Also some of the big Fords used Roadrangers behind gasser V8's. If you could locate that setup then get a Cummins/Ford adapter plate that might be an easy go.

Hollander's Interchange used at Dismantlers is a priceless source of info on this if you can finagle access to one. They come up for sale online also, not cheap at all. Here's some links for possible information and Cabell Garbee and Charles Talbert are both members here and can give you some info. I've never heard anything bad about Wilcap, so maybe holler at them. Don't commit to a solution until you've researched all possibilities, sometimes it's far easier that another person might suggest.

Cabell Garbee
http://www.garbee.net/~cabell/

Charles Talbert
http://www.mseriesrebuild.com/

Wilcap Transmission Adapters
http://www.wilcap.com/

[rmcoates]

Why Roadranger?

Welcome!
JimmieD has converted his Town Wagon to a Cummins, he may be up on the trans bolt pattern. From what I've heard, several bell housings will adapt to the Cummins so it may well be possible to find one that will bolt to both your trans and the Cummins.
Curious, what makes the Road Ranger so special and what are you trying to achieve with it, vs. other transmission options?

Thanks for the welcome. The reason I want a roadranger. Well the auto has got to go. To hard to repair for a shade tree mechanic like myself, not macho enough, not economical .... the list goes on. Love to shift without the clutch, not to mention easier on the clutch assy because you don't use it every time you shift... if I need more gears ... I got em ... should outlast the trannys offered by Dodge. When I was a teenager ( now I'm 54 ) driving rigs for my uncle I wanted a pickup with a diesel and a roadranger ... because I loved driving the big rigs. Forgot about it until the company I worked for offered me this truck for $500 and that brought back the memories since it is the first diesel I ever owned. Just one of those dreams I never fulfilled .... yet. Gonna do it .... I'll keep you posted.

[MoparNorm]

Ha!
I was looking for technical* reasons but we all know that emotional reasons carry more weight!
Good luck with it and keep us posted!

*Gear ratios, type of driving, etc.

[JimmieD]

Yes, RM, that makes perfect sense to me, too! Please keep us up to date on the progress and please, pictures, pictures, pictures are appreciated!

[rmcoates]

Gonna get started soon

Yes, RM, that makes perfect sense to me, too! Please keep us up to date on the progress and please, pictures, pictures, pictures are appreciated!

Ok, pictures will be coming. Looks like the 5.9 will be going in an 80 ford F350. Gonna get it also from the company for $500 ( because that is what they would get for it at the scrap yard) it has a flat bed and a 250 amp lincoln welder on it. Found a 1-ton pickup bed for it so the flat bed will be history and the welder will be added to my shop tools. Still trying to find a better deal on the roadranger rt6609 ( $1200 plus shipping so far is the best deal I can find). Gonna need air for the tranny, thinking of a small tank with a 12 volt compressor. Since I plan on removing the front cap in order to fit the engine and components I'm thinking about making it a flip front so I won't have to stand on my head to do the engine maintenance. Looks like I'm gonna have some 96 Dodge Ram 3500 parts for sale..... Auto tranny, transfer case, front axle, front cap and cab. I'll post some pics as soon as I get out there and take some. I thank you guys for the support.

[Gordon Maney]

The one issue I might wonder about is weight. What does that transmission weigh? The front ends on those trucks are under-designed as it is, at least in the ball joint sense, so....you might want to think about that. The Cummins powered 2nd generation trucks on seem to eat ball joints, due, apparently, to engine weight.

[rmcoates]

Roadranger weight

The one issue I might wonder about is weight. What does that transmission weigh? The front ends on those trucks are under-designed as it is, at least in the ball joint sense, so....you might want to think about that. The Cummins powered 2nd generation trucks on seem to eat ball joints, due, apparently, to engine weight.

The tranny I'm looking for weighs 380 lbs. It's a model RT6609a. Many medium heavy trucks have that combo .... 5.9 cummins with the RT6609a ... for example some FORD 7000's have that combo.

Yep, the 1-ton may not like it but I'm going with a FORD twin I-BEAM.... maybe that boy can handle it.

[Gordon Maney]

The tranny I'm looking for weighs 380 lbs. It's a model RT6609a. Many medium heavy trucks have that combo .... 5.9 cummins with the RT6609a ... for example some FORD 7000's have that combo.

Yep, the 1-ton may not like it but I'm going with a FORD twin I-BEAM.... maybe that boy can handle it.

That is interesting. I would not have guessed it as being that light. I am pretty sure that the NV5600 6-speed in my 2001 Ram weighs more than that.

[Tom Petroff]

First, the ford twin I beam was not all that great IMO.

Second, why would you want a roadranger RT 6609a?
It's a 9 speed direct drive heavy trans.
With stock gearing and tall tires you will be lucky to get get 60mph,
And "0" mpg.
The truck you mention will probably run 65mph at best with 20" tires and 9 MPG.
A smaller OD type is much better.

Ofcourse you could stuff a RTO9513 in there,and have more than you want.
TGP

[Gordon Maney]

First, the ford twin I beam was not all that great IMO.

Second, why would you want a roadranger RT 6609a?
It's a 9 speed direct drive heavy trans.
With stock gearing and tall tires you will be lucky to get get 60mph,
And "0" mpg.
The truck you mention will probably run 65mph at best with 20" tires and 9 MPG.
A smaller OD type is much better.

Of course you could stuff a RTO9513 in there,and have more than you want.

TGP

Could you explain more about that? I don't know anything about these transmissions. I understand the implications of the direct remark about the 6609A, but do not know what you are saying about the RTO9513.

Is there a range of physical sizes available for heavy duty trucks?

Tell us more, please.....

[Tom Petroff]

Eaton/Fuller Roadranger RTO9513
is a twin countershaft 13 peed overdrive transsmission used in medium/heavy trucks.
It is "Old" school.
Not used any more because of too much shifting.
Everyone now uses 6,7,8,9 speeds in large trucks.
That said there are still owner operators who will custom build there rigs with the RTO 9513,TROO 9513(double od) RTO 9510,RTO9515.
I don't think you could even stuff one between the frame of a one ton truck,lol
Will continue later,
Right now were going to Rual King. She's waiting,

Ha
TGP

[rmcoates]

Roadranger stuff

Could you explain more about that? I don't know anything about these transmissions. I understand the implications of the direct remark about the 6609A, but do not know what you are saying about the RTO9513.

Is there a range of physical sizes available for heavy duty trucks?

Tell us more, please.....

The RTO9513 is an overdrive tranny. The "R" stands for "Roadranger", the "T" stands for "Twin countershaft", and the "O" stands for "Overdrive", the "9" stands for "9 hundred foot pounds of torque rating", the "5" is the series (?) and the "13" stands for "13 speeds". This tranny weighs about 680 pounds which is about 300 more than the tranny I want. Which is a "R"oadranger "T"win countershaft ( no overdirve ) "6" hundred foot pounds of torque rating "6" series "09" speeds weighing in at 380 pounds which is probably less than my auto and transfer case.

I like shifting.... what can I say. And besides, I heard lots of bad things about the Dodge Cummins standard trannys. I personaly think it is stupid to have overdrive which causes the drive shaft to turn faster than the engine which is a greater strain on the engine than having straight drive with a higher rear gear ratio and a lower 1st gear tranny. I plan on changing the rear gear ratio and tire height to make a top speed of about 80 MPH which will put my sweet spot ( max torque RPM ) at about 65 MPH. I'm shooting for 20 MPG. With the double low available if I need it, I think I'll have what I want. I'll be starting this project in the next couple weeks..... I'll keep you guys posted.