Front Axle Cost...

[Doc Dave]

Lazarus,
One other option, that I and several others have gone with to get more speed but not break the bank or make a lot more work, is a Dennan overdrive.
Do a search on the two forums and you will see a lot of info on it.
It basically allows me to have a "5th gear". I retain my 5.83 diffs so have low end power with the stock flathead, but when I get up to speed, it drops the RPM's by about 500. I also retained the 9X16 tires. I can drive 50 without the engine totally screaming.
Also it can be removed in about 2 hours if necessary, if you want to go on a rock crawl, etc, and are concerned about damaging the unit.
As to power, I pulled my 2001 CTD Dodge pickup out of a ditch with the overdrive equipped PW. The 2001 weighs 7,000#.
The unit cost me about $1200, and the only thing you have to supply is to buy another driveshaft and have it shortened (unless you modify the original).
If you go to the expense and trouble of an engine and tranny swap, then you don't need this overdrive.
The only drawback is that the man who builds these up is retired so there is a wait time in getting one.

[Lazarus]

No diesel yet!

Thanks Desoto61, My daily driver is a 97 Ford, 7.3 L-Power Stroke (diesel fuel ^here in NM $4.09 a gal)... (maybe) someday! not in my plans for the PW... Like I say I have a 1966 Dodge 1/2 ton with 318 and a NP435-D3 it has no driver side PTO port..Now the 251 (R25) is not seized it is an option. Would like 55/60 mph, power steering, disc brakes and gear change..So sounds like! 251, nv4500, power steering, disc brakes and bigger tires...Now a bellhousing? getting closer...thks guys

[Desoto61]

Might want to look into other trans options too. The NV4500 isn't the cheapest beast to find and I think in most cases you're going to have to do some sort of custom adapter either way so I wouldn't rule out the Spicer or Ford 5-speeds either.

If you do go after an NV4500 and are reusing the NP200 then the Chevy 2WD version I think has a shorter tail shaft then the Dodge version, just watch as there are two versions of the Chevy NV4500.

I'd also wonder if some of the smaller trannies would work like the NV3500? I can't imagine the 251 puts out more than the trucks those smaller trannies came in.

[Lazarus]

Doc Dave, Thanks.. I have read some on it last week, but personally don't know anything about them. I'll well dig deeper sounds like that's a great idea the more I think about it...thks...gc
Drove all day at 45-50 mph wasn't that bad...of course I wasn't in a bucking PW either...

[Lazarus]

Lazarus,
One other option, that I and several others have gone with to get more speed but not break the bank or make a lot more work, is a Dennan overdrive.
Do a search on the two forums and you will see a lot of info on it.
It basically allows me to have a "5th gear". I retain my 5.83 diffs so have low end power with the stock flathead, but when I get up to speed, it drops the RPM's by about 500. I also retained the 9X16 tires. I can drive 50 without the engine totally screaming.
Also it can be removed in about 2 hours if necessary, if you want to go on a rock crawl, etc, and are concerned about damaging the unit.
As to power, I pulled my 2001 CTD Dodge pickup out of a ditch with the overdrive equipped PW. The 2001 weighs 7,000#.
The unit cost me about $1200, and the only thing you have to supply is to buy another driveshaft and have it shortened (unless you modify the original).
If you go to the expense and trouble of an engine and tranny swap, then you don't need this overdrive.
The only drawback is that the man who builds these up is retired so there is a wait time in getting one.

Sounds like you have had the best luck with it...It sure sounds good! MaineSS, thread states "to be continued", problems? a lot of machine work?...thks...gc

[Lazarus]

Your right! all freed up..Sweet.

ok

Is the engine still in the truck? yes. If so, you might be able to free it yourself. I did. Pull the spark plugs, pour some Marvel Mystery oil or some auto trans fluid in each hole, repeat every few days. I did. After a couple of weeks try prying against the ring gear with a bar, levering against the bell housing to see if you can move it a little. Take it slow. It moved like it was buttered! I have done this with three engines and got them to move, and then started them with a little gas in the carb and a battery. Haven't yet but looks good maybe this weak... thks gc

[Lazarus]

After reading John's post...

Congratulations on buying a truck that will redefine what a real truck is. However, rather than asking how you can upgrade the truck to your idea about what the truck should be, you might want to let the truck tell you what it is and adjust your thinking accordingly. Instead of cruising the interstate, you might want to discover the beauty of travelling the back roads.

Enjoy! Slow down, savor the moments! Post a picture or two when it arrives.
______________
JOHN Waak



I went out and looked over the truck again. I was awed at what John had written...I had one awesome time letting my new found friend tell me what's going on with him. After sitting for more than 25+ years. The engine, with a little attention (mystery oil) engine turns over like it's been buttered. Axles were locked up because the brakes were set for so many years. Drove out the brake shoe anchor bolts from the backs, the brake shoes released inside the drums. The truck showed me it had 3 bolts that were different. 1 each on 3 of the hubs (I'll call them drum puller bolts.) I when around pulling the 3 bolts off the other hubs. Unscrewed the 3 screwed out of the drum that holds it on the hub. Screwed the 3 drum puller bolts into the drum they hit the hub, pulling the drums into my hands. All drums and brakes off in 20 min. and I should have pictures later today...Off to a great start... thks ... gc

I can see why you guys love these trucks so much!

[Lazarus]

front axle cost

front axle cost???

[Desoto61]

If you are just doing bearings and seals I'd say about $1000 for the front, slightly lower for the rear since you don't have the knuckles to deal with. Bearing kit is $500/$600, seals will run another hundred or so. I had my front spider assembly sent to Charles Talbert at M-series which was a two or three hundred (don't remember specificaly and it varies depending on how beat up it is). That does not include brakes.

If you want to re-gear to 4.89 then add $500 per axle. Disk brakes are probably another $700/axle or so between the Ugly truckling kit, having the hubs machined, and the parts store pieces (rotors, calipers, pads, hoses). A set of lock-out hubs will run a few hundred depending on the type and where you get them from. I highly recommend a set since they will allow you to unlock the front axle to reduce wear on all those expensive components, and it improves mileage and steering as well.

If you want to go all out an ARB will set you back about $1000 though it makes setup easier and you won't need to have the stock spider assembly re-done. Charles also has an upgrade pinion seal adapter you can purchase that allows use of a more modern and reliable rubber seal, and better axle bushings for the knuckle housings that are smart upgrades regardless.

All this assumes you do most of the work yourself. If you contract it out you'll have to add labor. Bar none axles are probably the most expensive things on these trucks to rebuild outside of the engine. It's one of the reasons a lot of people look at replacing them with a more modern Dana axle. It can eliminate a lot of issues with these trucks though it creates it's own problems too.

[gmharris]

It depends what you want to do and how much money you want to spend.

The axles on any old Power Wagon that has been sitting for years will need some service. They should be opened up and the bearings inspected and lubed and the seals replaced. Bushings, brakes shoes, tie rod ends, hoses wheel cylinders and all the other "stuff" should be replaced as needed. Depending on condition, it easy enough to spend north of $500 re-conditioning a set of axles.

However, I don't see the need to spend more unless you just feel the need to spend money. If the differentials themselves are in bad shape for some reason, it's easier to just get a good used differential.

I've seen some pretty high asking prices for complete axles or differentials. But, realistically, it's pretty hard to sell a set of axles. Every truck that is parted out has a pair of axles, many of which have differentials which are in good shape.

A guy near me just sent a pair to the scrap yard after trying unsuccessfully to sell them. I have two extra sets including one set with 4.89's. Where are you located? Someone may be near you with the parts you need.

[Lazarus]

Ouch!

!

If you are just doing bearings and seals I'd say about $1000 for the front, slightly lower for the rear since you don't have the knuckles to deal with. Bearing kit is $500/$600, seals will run another hundred or so. I had my front spider assembly sent to Charles Talbert at M-series which was a two or three hundred (don't remember specificaly and it varies depending on how beat up it is). That does not include brakes.

If you want to re-gear to 4.89 then add $500 per axle. Disk brakes are probably another $700/axle or so between the Ugly truckling kit, having the hubs machined, and the parts store pieces (rotors, calipers, pads, hoses). A set of lock-out hubs will run a few hundred depending on the type and where you get them from. I highly recommend a set since they will allow you to unlock the front axle to reduce wear on all those expensive components, and it improves mileage and steering as well.

If you want to go all out an ARB will set you back about $1000 though it makes setup easier and you won't need to have the stock spider assembly re-done. Charles also has an upgrade pinion seal adapter you can purchase that allows use of a more modern and reliable rubber seal, and better axle bushings for the knuckle housings that are smart upgrades regardless.

All this assumes you do most of the work yourself. If you contract it out you'll have to add labor. Bar none axles are probably the most expensive things on these trucks to rebuild outside of the engine. It's one of the reasons a lot of people look at replacing them with a more modern Dana axle. It can eliminate a lot of issues with these trucks though it creates it's own problems too.

Well! Sounds like I'd best order all bearings and seals - if some bearing are not used I'll have them in stock! for the future of the truck.. yes will change to 4.89 pinion w/ upgrade seal adapter, ARB yes, Disk brakes yes. Every thing else as needed...Ouch for pocket book... thks good stuff! Desoto61 telling it like it is...

[Lazarus]

Going in!

!

It depends what you want to do and how much money you want to spend.

The axles on any old Power Wagon that has been sitting for years will need some service. They should be opened up and the bearings inspected and lubed and the seals replaced. Bushings, brakes shoes, tie rod ends, hoses wheel cylinders and all the other "stuff" should be replaced as needed. Depending on condition, it easy enough to spend north of $500 re-conditioning a set of axles.

However, I don't see the need to spend more unless you just feel the need to spend money. If the differentials themselves are in bad shape for some reason, it's easier to just get a good used differential.

I've seen some pretty high asking prices for complete axles or differentials. But, realistically, it's pretty hard to sell a set of axles. Every truck that is parted out has a pair of axles, many of which have differentials which are in good shape.

A guy near me just sent a pair to the scrap yard after trying unsuccessfully to sell them. I have two extra sets including one set with 4.89's. Where are you located? Someone may be near you with the parts you need.

Well used is used. Guess I'll go into mine and see what kind of shape their in and know what condition I put them in once I'm out and on the ROAD.. thks gc

[Desoto61]

Most of the bearings for the differentials are available at just about any auto parts store for reasonable cost. However the double race set in the front of the pinion shaft is stupid money and what makes the kit so expensive.

I've read of someone using a pair of the single races and machining a spacer to hold them at the correct distance (might have even been in my thread). If you could find or machine the spacer cheap enough you could save a lot of money.

If you are not a subscriber to the magazine or a premium forum member now might be a good time to do so. The search feature can turn up all the bearing and seal numbers you'll need. Many of the original seals can be replaced with more modern equivalents that are easier to get and will work far better.

With the numbers you can shop around for the bearings and seals locally or on line, though the bearing kit at VPW wasn't a horrible deal considering the cost of that double race bearing elsewhere (if you can even find it).

I did re-use some of the bearings from my front differential when I rebuilt it. Just couldn't justify the cost when they all looked good and the front differential sees so much less use then the rear, especially with the lock out hubs installed. Same with the ARB, just too expensive to do one up front. I could add one in the future if I found the need, but I kind of doubt it.

Good luck!

[Charles Talbert]

Simple truth

The differentials rebuilt right are far and away the most costly gear box on the truck to rebuild. Adding 4.89 gearing adds about another $425 or so to that. Bearings are off the charts in cost and headed upwards. Top quality bearings for 1 unit off the shelf today are around $750 or more in cost. We still have some in stock that we paid a reasonable price for, however when those are gone, I'm just not sure where cost will go.

My advice is simply this; take care of these units the best you can. If unsure of the condition, pull them down, clean them up, and repair as needed. If you wait until one goes down on you; you will be shocked at the repair cost.

[Lazarus]

Meat!

!

Most of the bearings for the differentials are available at just about any auto parts store for reasonable cost. However the double race set in the front of the pinion shaft is stupid money and what makes the kit so expensive.

I've read of someone using a pair of the single races and machining a spacer to hold them at the correct distance (might have even been in my thread). If you could find or machine the spacer cheap enough you could save a lot of money.

If you are not a subscriber to the magazine or a premium forum member now might be a good time to do so. The search feature can turn up all the bearing and seal numbers you'll need. Many of the original seals can be replaced with more modern equivalents that are easier to get and will work far better.

With the numbers you can shop around for the bearings and seals locally or on line, though the bearing kit at VPW wasn't a horrible deal considering the cost of that double race bearing elsewhere (if you can even find it).

I did re-use some of the bearings from my front differential when I rebuilt it. Just couldn't justify the cost when they all looked good and the front differential sees so much less use then the rear, especially with the lock out hubs installed. Same with the ARB, just too expensive to do one up front. I could add one in the future if I found the need, but I kind of doubt it.

Good luck!

Thanks that's a lot of meat! awesome info thks gc