Why buy a Diesel?

[Jonas Smith]

Hijacked thread....

I'm talking about buying a fill size rig, with a full size diesel, not the 4bt conversions. I dont think anyone would put a 34' gooseneck with 2 power wagons loaded up on the back of a M37 with a 4BT installed, and drive it to Iowa from Washington state.

Since we are talking about it, what is the cost of Charles's standard 4bt repower for a M37?

Jonas

[BobbyMike]

Thanks Cabell, for the estimate and the advice.

I use my truck for work. I want to get a little more "umph", with a little less $ per mile. Currently "Old Yeller" is running fine and gets me where I need to go, sometimes more slowly than I want (I do live in the mountains). The truck is not set up for towing, nor do I intend to fit it for towing in the future. I use it to haul gravel, firewood, manure, get to jobsites, and tool around back country dirt roads. I'd like to drive out to Iowa, one of these Junes.

I doubt "Old Yeller" ever be a Fenway, as I use it pretty rough sometimes, but I would like to upgrade the mechanicals and electrical system. I can see another 40 years of use in the truck if I treat it right.

[BobbyMike]

I'm talking about buying a fill size rig, with a full size diesel, not the 4bt conversions. I dont think anyone would put a 34' gooseneck with 2 power wagons loaded up on the back of a M37 with a 4BT installed, and drive it to Iowa from Washington state.

Since we are talking about it, what is the cost of Charles's standard 4bt repower for a M37?

Jonas

Sorry about the Hijack, Jonas. If you'd like I'll start another thread (sheepish grin).

[Sickcall]

Jonas your thread did get hi-jacked very early on. I appologize for continuing the tangent. You asked about economics and you got the die-hard testimonials of the benefits of owning a diesel. Norn gave a good post on the spreadsheet approach of whether or not it is economical for you. You being the key. If, like Norm, it has 20,000#'s behind it, then its more economical than a gas engine. If its a grocery getter that drops the kids off at school then someone is just fooling themselves. I would guesstamate that 75% of all driving done in a medium size diesel truck is in the non economical performance range. Just my local observations. Don't calculate the resale valve into the economic equation if you have to keep your truck for the long haul as some have stated, flawed voodoo economics.

You mentioned earlier on that you thought a Ram 50 may be more appropiate. I wouldn't touch one of those, for any reason, as they are probably going to frustrate you more with repairs than the truck you presently own. A good lunch box truck would be an early 90's Toyota with a FI 22re engine. The Toyota is the best most reliable small truck built and it would serve you well for hundreds of thousands of miles. But then again you would need to figure this into the spreadsheet also. Hey now, isn't the Toyota truck built in America?

[CGarbee]

The price on the 4bt's keeps going up. In the last transportation auction the only P30 van on the west coast went for $2750. These previously enjoyed engines are going to get harder to find at a reasonable price. I hope next months auction is better.

Whoops... 4.89 gears.... Bad day at the keyboard... Thanks for catching that one...

I know that the P30 vans on Dovebid have been going up, but then, I helped a buddy load one a few weeks back that he got for $750. It was missing the driveshaft and the transmissin was slipping, but the body and engine were in great shape. Figure that he will make a little money on the deal by the time he ships the aluminum body and the steel frame to the scrap yard and parts out the axles, radiator, and other parts that he does not need or want...

There are still a lot of these engines running around in bread trucks (not to mention other uses), so you can always wait for the next sale...

[Gordon Maney]

Whoops... 4.89 gears.... Bad day at the keyboard... Thanks for catching that one...

I know that the P30 vans on Dovebid have been going up, but then, I helped a buddy load one a few weeks back that he got for $750. It was missing the driveshaft and the transmissin was slipping, but the body and engine were in great shape. Figure that he will make a little money on the deal by the time he ships the aluminum body and the steel frame to the scrap yard and parts out the axles, radiator, and other parts that he does not need or want...

There are still a lot of these engines running around in bread trucks (not to mention other uses), so you can always wait for the next sale...

What engines are used in Fed-Ex and UPS trucks?

[CGarbee]

Depends on the truck size... The smallest of the UPS trucks are running 4.3L gas or Cummins 6AT3.4, the medium sized UPS/FedEx trucks are running 4BT/BTA or ISB3.9 and the larger ones are running 6BT/BTA or ISB5.9 depending on age.

You do have to check though when looking at them since in some areas of the country, they are using GM6.x engines which were fitted in some of the route vans before GM sold their chasis plant to Frieghtliner.

For that matter, some of the IBC trucks getting sold off by Dovebid still have the Hercules DT3.7 engine that was utilized in the MARS conversions that Paul Caudil marketed.

[MoparNorm]

.... If its a grocery getter that drops the kids off at school then someone is just fooling themselves. I would guesstamate that 75% of all driving done in a medium size diesel truck is in the non economical performance range...

One thing to consider is the new generation of small diesels. The "grocery getter" Jeep Liberty with the 2.8 Detroit Diesel gets over 30 mpg, the same vehicle with the 3.6 V-6 gets 24 mpg. Both are highway mileage, your mileage will vary.
The Jeep Grand Cherokee is being offered with a 3.0 Merc. diesel that is rated at 35 mpg. There are a bunch of small, quiet, economical, fuel efficient diesels coming down the pipeline. Because of the ULSD fiasco, they won't really explode onto the Mopar scene until 2008, but given just about any scenario I'd take the diesel motor over the gas motor for fuel economy, low end torque and longevity.
MN

[Sickcall]

Norm, Jonas does not drive one of those. He asked us not to hijack his thread so I was answering his question concerning his current Dodge 3500. But yeh, its nice and economical......

[MoparNorm]

Well, he noted that his question was about the 3500, but in the same post he asked about the 4bt...ha!ha! I was simply pointing out that diesels will soon be available throughout the engine spectrum with fuel savings and more torque across the board.
I'm still convinced that Jonas was the sad recipient of a lemon and that his experience is atypical of the majority of diesel users. He shouldn't cast judgement with only that experience. If I judged all diesels by my first bad experience, a pathetic 7.3 ferd, then I would have never known the beauty of the Cummins.
Besides, as long as he is eating my steaks I'm going to talk about whatever I want...ha!ha!

MN

[Sickcall]

Norm, I would like to buy one of those diesels when they finally make it here, but until then I will make do with my present mode of transportation. I haven't figured out it's trade in value yet.......

[JimmieD]

That thing got a ...... never mind

[MoparNorm]

Ha!Ha!
MN

[IHWillys]

...For that matter, some of the IBC trucks getting sold off by Dovebid still have the Hercules DT3.7 engine that was utilized in the MARS conversions that Paul Caudil marketed.

Yes, I have two of the Hercules sitting in my garage now. They both have Warner T19s behind them so they are ripe for a swap into anything 2WD or with divorced transfercase.

And Charles, I'm going to call, I just hadn't seen your reply until now.

Ken