The 230 Headerfold project

[Sickcall]

Monkie,

Thread keeps progressing with some good information. I have been traveling overseas and am not able to post frequently. I used a 2 inch Magnaflow, its a straight thru design like a glass pack but does not burn out. It is also stainless and the one used is almost the same size as the original m37 muffler.

Since I built a combined intake/exhaust I welded it all to the same flange plate. I like how easy everything bolts on at the same time! The thickness used for the plate was 1/2 inch as I did not want to have gasket problems. I surfaced the gasket side of the plate to make it flat and used stock intake exhaust gasket from Felpro. It has been on the road for 4 years and hasn't leaked yet.

[JimmieD]

I've not used it in years. Can't remember thickess, but depends on application too. Some go as thick as 1/16" or better, depends. PAW and Slummit sell it, as do most large performance vendors. Referred to as 'dead soft copper', meaning it's not annealed or work hardened.

[monkeymissile]

thicknum

As I recall, dead-soft copper is the best gasket material, reuseable too.

Jimmie,
seems like 16ga would work nicely?

[JimmieD]

As I recall, dead-soft copper is the best gasket material, reuseable too.

[monkeymissile]

Kansas Kustoms

for those who are interested.......

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[monkeymissile]

vintage

I didnt have them done by that company. The guy I got them from made them when he was a teenager back in the 50s. They were in his 1940 dodge hotrod. Im gunna use them on my Plymouth and run dual Smithys. Im making a another set for another flathead six Im building and will put in Power Wagon when I get one.

Ande yes welding cast iron is a pain, but if done right can be a beautiful thing.

Coolio, vintage modifications! Are you making this other set from another manifold as well? Look forward to seeing pics.

Justin

[XwelderX]

Well, what I think is that you have a split manifold and not really a "header" since the primaries are even shorter than on a shorty-style header. I saw somewhere on the web an outfit in, I think, Kansas that can do this modification. Is that where you had this done or did you do it? The place I saw did a sweet job; as many know welding cast iron is tricky.
Anyway, I am by no means an expert in exhaust/header design. Splitting the header should offer some increased performance. What are your plans now, dual exhaust or some sort of 2:1 collector? Standard muffler or aftermarket?
I am hoping to build much longer primary pipes to get better scavenging.

Justin

I didnt have them done by that company. The guy I got them from made them when he was a teenager back in the 50s. They were in his 1940 dodge hotrod. Im gunna use them on my Plymouth and run dual Smithys. Im making a another set for another flathead six Im building and will put in Power Wagon when I get one.

Ande yes welding cast iron is a pain, but if done right can be a beautiful thing.

[monkeymissile]

The reason I asked about the gasket is that headers seem to be trickier to seal than manifolds, and often come with special gaskets. I haven't looked for any 230 header gaskets, so I don't know whether anyone makes them. It would be interesting to see what SickCall's experience has been.

mSS,
what makes headers harder to seal? Maybe I use that metal-backed gasket material, the stuff that compresses? Not sure what else to use honestly.

Justin

[maineSS]

The reason I asked about the gasket is that headers seem to be trickier to seal than manifolds, and often come with special gaskets. I haven't looked for any 230 header gaskets, so I don't know whether anyone makes them. It would be interesting to see what SickCall's experience has been.

[monkeymissile]

Hi there. Here is a set of dual headers going on my 230. They were made just by splitting the original manifold and welding them up.

what ya think??

Well, what I think is that you have a split manifold and not really a "header" since the primaries are even shorter than on a shorty-style header. I saw somewhere on the web an outfit in, I think, Kansas that can do this modification. Is that where you had this done or did you do it? The place I saw did a sweet job; as many know welding cast iron is tricky.
Anyway, I am by no means an expert in exhaust/header design. Splitting the header should offer some increased performance. What are your plans now, dual exhaust or some sort of 2:1 collector? Standard muffler or aftermarket?
I am hoping to build much longer primary pipes to get better scavenging.

Justin

[XwelderX]

Hi there. Here is a set of dual headers going on my 230. They were made just by splitting the original manifold and welding them up.

what ya think??

[monkeymissile]

It would be really neat if you could come up with a way to disassemble the header that didn't leak and didn't require messing with the gasket. Have any idea what you're going to use for the gasket?

disassembly would be sweet, just another level of complexity that may or may not be feasible when I get right down to it. It seems like competition headers often have all the various sections connected with tabs and screws so that they can be easily swapped out based on race conditions. I figured if that system works for them it ought to work for us right? Snug fitting swaged connections with plenty of overlap and liberal copper anti-seize might do it don't you think?
I haven't thought about anything other than standard gasket material so far. Got any suggestions?

[maineSS]

It would be really neat if you could come up with a way to disassemble the header that didn't leak and didn't require messing with the gasket. Have any idea what you're going to use for the gasket?

[monkeymissile]

retainers

MM- I think valve adjustments with a header in place will be virtually impossible- they're difficult with the stock manifold. Option #2 would be the way to go in my opinion, as you'll get a lot more fab difficulty for not much additional gain with Option#1- especially if you keep the stock intake. The 251 had 115 hp with 7:1 CR, and 125 hp with 8:1 CR compared to the 120 hp @7.9:1 CR of the last 230's. Even with 21 more CID, the flathead was running up against fundamental breathing limitations. Reduce restriction and make it fit easily- that will make life better for most PW users.

mSS,
I am leaning towards option B as well, mostly due to the simplified fabrication. If I was clever I would maybe add retaining tabs and slip-fit connections right below the intake manifold so that the bulk of the header could be removed for easier servicing.

[maineSS]

MM- I think valve adjustments with a header in place will be virtually impossible- they're difficult with the stock manifold. Option #2 would be the way to go in my opinion, as you'll get a lot more fab difficulty for not much additional gain with Option#1- especially if you keep the stock intake. The 251 had 115 hp with 7:1 CR, and 125 hp with 8:1 CR compared to the 120 hp @7.9:1 CR of the last 230's. Even with 21 more CID, the flathead was running up against fundamental breathing limitations. Reduce restriction and make it fit easily- that will make life better for most PW users.